Wednesday, August 15, 2007

It List: Wednesday 8/15/07


Mom/Tree Wave/Shiny Around the Edges/Voot Cha Index/History at Our Disposal (Granada): I've been looking forward to this one for the past week or so-- seems like a really big show for Mom, a band that has the backing of CJ Davis' record label and a reputation for solid live shows that seems to be growing by the day. Frankly, I find it strange and quite pleasing that they've received as much attention as they have to this point-- Dallas is one of the last places in which you'd expect to see a quiet, soundscaping "electroacoustic" band start to gain a noteworthy following. More Music for Airports than Behind the Music, Mom's compositions are typically like a pleasant daydream, and I mean that as a compliment. Rounding out the bill are the excellent Shiny Around the Edges and Voot Cha Index, a band that clearly isn't for everyone but probably underrated locally.... it's too bad they have to break up before any of them are old enough to hang out in many of the places they perform. And this just seems like the perfect place to make my final DOMA comment of the year--honestly, free food and shit like that aside, how many of you would rather see tonight's Granada line-up than last nights? Despite the potentially contrarian anon comments this question will attract, I'm guessing the percentage is quite high, even among those who actually went to the ceremony last night. To me, that says it all.

Sarah Reddington Farewell Show with New Science Projects/Daniel Folmer/Chris Garver (Rubber Gloves): The members of Sarah Reddington are clearly smart-- they picked the month of August (and the hottest week of the year at that) to pack up and ship off to beautiful Portland, OR where they plan to continue being Sarah Reddington in much more tolerable temperatures. I honestly didn't get to spend a whole lot of time with their music while they played around these parts, but I always dug what I heard, and I wish them the best. They sound like a band that could continue to become more and more interesting.
La Piovra/The Bleach Boys/Druids on Parade (1919 Hemphill): Bleach Boys rule. Seriously. Listen.
Sorry... Myspace isn't working for me right now, so I guess you can't listen.

49 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

"To me, that says it all."
How's that? Obviously most of us would rather hear that lineup of bands than Wilonsky's Nostalgia Jerk-Off Revue, but it's not a fair comparison. Last night wasn't supposed to be a concert, it was an awards presentation. They didn't need to draw anyone other than nominees and their friends & families.
Or are you trying to imply that this is a lineup of WSJR darlings that the D.O. is overlooking? The Observer has covered every band playing at the Granada tonight. And the D.O. wrote up this show on its blog, too--before you, at that.
Don't get me wrong. Everyone knows the music section is a complete failure under Jonanna. Hopefully she'll be gone soon. But comparisons between a CD release concert and an award ceremony are meaningless.

5:16 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

INTERNET FIGHT!

5:17 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

this is also voot cha index's last show EVER

5:22 PM  
Blogger jonofdeath said...

Also, if you want to see a band from Dallas that just got signed to Universal back in April go to the Door in Dallas. A band called Forever the Sickest Kids is playing. Not exactly freak-folk, but it is who is getting signed these days to major labels.

5:25 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

i liked that band better when they were call thursday, and i really didn't like them much then.

5:29 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Never mind, SR, don't bother answering. We've all heard enough about the stupid DOMAs. I'm embarrassed that I wrote that much about something I should care so little about.
-contrarian anon 5:16

5:29 PM  
Blogger stonedranger said...

In what way does the format of the show matter? Or are you being willfully obtuse?

I think it is quite meaningful and rather indicative of the state of the observer in general: once a year, they have an awards ceremony/show/party in celebration of the local music scene, and what do they do? Get a couple "supergroups" full of mostly crap musicians to play cover songs and bore the hell out of everyone in between the presentation of awards to other bands that mostly suck. Great.

Then, the very next night, several young, innovative, relevant bands all come together and play an interesting local show, exhibiting EVERYTHING that the observer missed last night. You don't think the "music awards" should have featured any decent music because it was an awards show rather than just a regular show? This connection doesn't make any sense to you? And do you actually think it means anything that they posted something about this show a hour or so before we did? Wow. Congrats to them. This is their job... you know, the thing they're supposed to be doing all day. I'm glad they were able to make a little blog post about a local show today.

The point is that comparing what went on last night with what is going on tonight exposes the poor taste of the observer staff and the poor execution with which they planned the DOMA awards.

5:31 PM  
Blogger stonedranger said...

too late... I already responded. But right after I published, I felt the exact same way you did... like talking about this any more is a complete waste of time.

I won't respond to any more comments about it, and you can feel free to do the same.

5:33 PM  
Blogger Sam Machkovech said...

Goodness--my genitalia just turned from outtie to innie listening to that. They make Bowling For Soup sound like Centro-matic.

5:34 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I love this blog..

it seriously makes and ruins my day all at the same time! hahah..

you're all weiners and winners..

5:37 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

hahah.. sam.. that band is pretty bad..

they might end up making some money on some warped tour or something..

but eventually that band will get shelved and whoever signed them will get the axe within a year or so.

Besides.. Getting fired by a label is the new getting signed by a label..

5:40 PM  
Blogger patricia said...

akkolyte is also playing the 1919 showwww

5:51 PM  
Blogger Paradeofflesh said...

I am banned from The Door, since "To Catch a Predator" caught up with me. NBC's Chris Hansen is such a motherfucker to ruin my good time.

5:52 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

holy shit i just bought that DN or D&N or whatever release from mayrrh records up Strawberry Fields. the neveda hill and some other person thing. the little three-inch CD. it is fucking fantastic! highly recommended. i know ya'll did a review of it and whatnot but i'm just giving my 2cents i guess. buy that shit. seriously. it is one of the best local releases i've heard so far. i could go on and on about it. it's beautiful music.

5:57 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

sorry. it's mayyrh records. not mayrrh.

5:59 PM  
Anonymous -|zs|- said...

Not only will the fine D & N 3-inch be at the show Saturday night at House of Tinnitus, but so will the brand-new Zanzibar Snails 3-inch EP (best thing we've done) ...

and best of all we just found out that the "D" man, David Price, will be joining us as well, from Austin ... you haven't lived till you've heard what Dave does with amplified muffin pans

probably his last show w/ us before he moves to NYC (this is a disturbing trend) ... so come say hi

7:20 PM  
Anonymous shane said...

short attention span theater @ hailey's

claymation night

7:40 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The Observer music section is definitely lacking these days, but in some ways it will never win with everybody no matter what. I remember when writer Christina Rees tried to give Denton more exposure several years ago and did an article about shows in the basement of Mr. Gatti's on the square. There was a backlash. The cops (possibly coincidentally) started cracking down on the shows, trying to bust minors for drinking. I remember some punk rock girl with a zine freaking out about how Christina was trying to gain "cred" by doing the piece. So, in that case, the Observer was giving DIY-type stuff too much exposure.

When I lived in Denton, most of the Denton bands were suspicious of Dallas bands. When I moved to Dallas, I became friends with some of the people I previously found suspect merely because of their Dallasite status. I think it's natural and even healthy for younger, DIY, grassroots-level bands, artists, and publications to challenge the older, "establishment" folks (see "anti" festivals such as South-by-So-What, the ones at Sundance, etc.). I include this blog in the natural and healthy category. I do think the vitriol in the comments is often pretty ridiculous, though admittedly entertaining at times.

Of course, you can't please everybody all of the time, but the Observer is probably at its best when it tries to strike some kind of balance between Denton and Dallas, young and old, and established and underground. At the moment, the scales are obviously tipped too far in one direction.

8:47 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Went to the Door once. Ended up stealing the emo band's beer since I didnt know the place was dry ...

9:17 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

MAN
i checked out forever the sickedt kids while perusing the sjiyyu hair cut pop hxc scene a mpnth ago andfuck cock balls

2:54 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

And I thought emo bands only drank their own tears.

9:25 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Think what you want about the DO and their awards but to call the musicians that backed everyone all night "crap" is just wrong.
Perhaps one has to play some to appreciate what a good job they did. Regardless, they are some of the most talented instrumentalists in the area.

10:56 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Agreed, 10:56. To extoll recycled riot grrl tripe like Christian Teenage Runaways, who make Wayward Grrl looke like King Crimson, and then call the guys in Shibboleth "crap" is exponential idiocy.

11:08 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

TALENT DOESN'T EXIST FUCKWAD! SHUT UP! GOD! YOU'RE PATHETIC!

11:10 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Whether unintentional or for comedic effect, nothing says "uneducated psycho" more than typing in all caps.

11:26 AM  
Blogger Defensive Listening said...

Anonymous:

"Think what you want about the DO and their awards but to call the musicians that backed everyone all night "crap" is just wrong.
Perhaps one has to play some to appreciate what a good job they did. Regardless, they are some of the most talented instrumentalists in the area."

10:56 AM

AND

Anonymous said...
"Agreed, 10:56. To extoll recycled riot grrl tripe like Christian Teenage Runaways, who make Wayward Grrl looke like King Crimson, and then call the guys in Shibboleth "crap" is exponential idiocy."


I'm starting to catch on to this way of thinking. I mean the other day I saw an Academy Sports commercial, and there was a pretty smokin' guitar solo being played in the background by a very capable musician, and I thought, "If I could just try to play some of those hot licks, I might understand what goes into being someone who might contemplate playing such incredible music."

Nobody called out Shibboleth specifically, I think it was the whole idea in general. I'm glad The Observer put together a presentation that was to your liking. You should just be grateful that you liked it. You're in pretty exclusive company there, my friends.

11:43 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

PSYCHO COP FROM HELL

12:13 PM  
Blogger doorbells said...

The DO Awards should be held at Academy.

1:01 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Once again, DL, you miss the point. You can be an accomplished musician and not be a weedly-weedly tasteless wanker. Likewise, you can be an unaccomplished musician with bad ideas dishing out crap that masquerades as art. I wasn't particularly enamored of the concept for the awards show. What I saw of it was OK, but the musicians definitely weren't "crap."

1:21 PM  
Blogger Defensive Listening said...

"Once again, DL, you miss the point. You can be an accomplished musician and not be a weedly-weedly tasteless wanker. Likewise, you can be an unaccomplished musician with bad ideas dishing out crap that masquerades as art. I wasn't particularly enamored of the concept for the awards show. What I saw of it was OK, but the musicians definitely weren't "crap.""

I didn't miss anything. We have different opinions of what "accomplished" means.

1:38 PM  
Anonymous justin said...

To divert attention to recent mudslinging, I'd like to say how great the show at the Granada was last night. There wasn't a weak link in the lineup, and I liked how it was set up so things moved quickly and you just had to turn around to see the next band start right away.

With all the bitching and moaning on this blog, in the observer, and in the dfwd area in general, it was really nice to be there among so many fellow musicians who were geniunely interested in being part of a community. Last night I saw members of Eat Avery’s Bones, Teenage Symphony, Baboon, The Paper Chase, Bosque Brown, Deathray Davies, Bangarang, and probably even more that I can’t think of or didn’t recognize in attendance supporting 5 really great bands, the departure of one and the arrival of a new record for another. I was pretty happy to be there, and hope its a sign of more good things to come.

1:50 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

well congratulations, you have won...

2:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Well, DL, I'll go with the dictionary definition of "accomplished" generally accepted by speakers of the English language. This one from dictionary.com will do:

ac·com·plished /Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[uh-kom-plisht] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–adjective

1. completed; done; effected: an accomplished fact.
2. highly skilled; expert: an accomplished pianist.
3. having all the social graces, manners, and other attainments of polite society.

Number two seems most appropriate, so I'll go with that one. So, that means you must define it as number 1 or number 3. Hmmm..., those don't seem to apply.

What you really meant was that you have a different definition than what you thought my definition of "accomplished" was as it relates to musicianship. You thought my definition was something along the lines of, "being able to play really fast, hot licks on a souped-up axe." Wrong again!

To clarify, I do believe accomplished musicians can be tasteless wankers and unaccomplished musicians can have great ideas and be more artful and expressive in general. In fact, I often prefer the latter. I just don't think it's always automatically the case as you seem to imply. Or at least this blog seems to imply, as I've seen that reasoning propagated here in the past.

2:39 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

LA PIOVRA RULLLEEZZZZ

3:09 PM  
Blogger Defensive Listening said...

2:39-"Well, DL, I'll go with the dictionary definition of "accomplished" generally accepted by speakers of the English language. This one from dictionary.com will do:

ac·com·plished /Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[uh-kom-plisht] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–adjective

1. completed; done; effected: an accomplished fact.
2. highly skilled; expert: an accomplished pianist.
3. having all the social graces, manners, and other attainments of polite society.

Number two seems most appropriate, so I'll go with that one. So, that means you must define it as number 1 or number 3. Hmmm..., those don't seem to apply.

What you really meant was that you have a different definition than what you thought my definition of "accomplished" was as it relates to musicianship. You thought my definition was something along the lines of, "being able to play really fast, hot licks on a souped-up axe." Wrong again!

To clarify, I do believe accomplished musicians can be tasteless wankers and unaccomplished musicians can have great ideas and be more artful and expressive in general. In fact, I often prefer the latter. I just don't think it's always automatically the case as you seem to imply. Or at least this blog seems to imply, as I've seen that reasoning propagated here in the past."

Dear 2:39,

I prefer Merriam-Webster to uh, "Dictionary.com." Here you go. All of these are fine by me:

1 : to bring about (a result) by effort- "have much to accomplish today"
2 : to bring to completion : FULFILL "we can accomplish the job in an hour"
3 : to succeed in reaching (a stage in a progression) "would starve before accomplishing half the distance -- W. H. Hudson died 1922"
4 archaic a : to equip thoroughly

Notice there isn't a particular value assigned to any of these definitions, so as not to color or incorrectly overload them, much like the way you (mis) use the word.

The definition that you agree with used "accomplished pianist" as an example which only makes my point for me. An accomplished pianist in general is about as boring as a tasteless axe wanker and these are interchangeable as far as examples are concerned. This is We Shot JR. Not NPR.

As far as your comment about "unaccomplished musicians" being capable of having great ideas and being more expressive and artful in general, again you have made my point for me. If I think someone is expressive, artful and possessing the ability to come up with great ideas, I would never refer to said person as unaccomplished. The fact that you're arrogant enough to do so further solidifies my rationale and highlights the disparity between our opinions regarding "musicianship." So much for your quick summary of my reasoning.

3:10 PM  
Blogger stonedranger said...

served?

3:22 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Nope. Hold for response...

3:49 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Sarah Reddington's show last night was probably the best show I've ever been too. All of the bands were amazing.

Thanks guys

4:06 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

There's just one problem with your choices for "accomplish." They are all verbs. "Accomplished" in the sense I'm using it is an adjective which generally means "skilled." My Pocket Oxford Dictionary and Thesaurus (cue the chamber orchestra) defines accomplished as "clever; skilled" with its synonyms being "consummate, expert, masterful, adept." Granted, you could argue that a skilled pianist isn't clever and CTR are, but the rest of the definitions point to someone who has achieved a certain level of technical expertise. By your "Academy" commercial example, I assumed that the point you were trying to make was that all technically adept musicians are tasteless wankers. I've seen that point made in the past on this blog. Now, you seem to imply it wasn't the point you were trying to make. I think you're being intellectually dishonest.

I wasn't trying to dispute the point that less technically adept musicians are often more expressive and artful and generally more gratifying to listen to, only the absolute that you seem to assert that they always are. It seems to be a little hypocritical to promote skilled musicians for the New Amsterdam "Jazz Night" but to make a sweeping indictment of all skilled pianists as "boring." Maybe you're the boor. And, no, that's not a misspelling.

I would never say a musician who's just played his or her first note hasn't accomplished anything. I think that's a huge accomplishment. I just wouldn't mistake "accomplished" as an adjective for "accomplished" as a verb in the past tense.

4:15 PM  
Anonymous mc said...

As espoused by Albini in his recent poker rant, one of the most accomplished pianists of the 20th century may be Conlon Nancarrow, who doesn't play piano at all on his records. He just programs a player piano.

Anyways, just wanted to point out a Defensive Listening-friendly "accomplished pianist."

Thanks to Albini for going back to this guy's stuff by the way.

5:10 PM  
Blogger Defensive Listening said...

"There's just one problem with your choices for "accomplish." They are all verbs. "Accomplished" in the sense I'm using it is an adjective which generally means "skilled." My Pocket Oxford Dictionary and Thesaurus (cue the chamber orchestra) defines accomplished as "clever; skilled" with its synonyms being "consummate, expert, masterful, adept." Granted, you could argue that a skilled pianist isn't clever and CTR are, but the rest of the definitions point to someone who has achieved a certain level of technical expertise. By your "Academy" commercial example, I assumed that the point you were trying to make was that all technically adept musicians are tasteless wankers. I've seen that point made in the past on this blog. Now, you seem to imply it wasn't the point you were trying to make. I think you're being intellectually dishonest.

I wasn't trying to dispute the point that less technically adept musicians are often more expressive and artful and generally more gratifying to listen to, only the absolute that you seem to assert that they always are. It seems to be a little hypocritical to promote skilled musicians for the New Amsterdam "Jazz Night" but to make a sweeping indictment of all skilled pianists as "boring." Maybe you're the boor. And, no, that's not a misspelling.

I would never say a musician who's just played his or her first note hasn't accomplished anything. I think that's a huge accomplishment. I just wouldn't mistake "accomplished" as an adjective for "accomplished" as a verb in the past tense."

4:15 pm



Okay. My mistake. As an adjective:

Main Entry: ac·com·plished
Function: adjective
1 a : proficient as the result of practice or training "an accomplished dancer"; also : skillfully done or produced "an accomplished film" b : having many social accomplishments

2 : established beyond doubt or dispute "an accomplished fact"

Proficiency is always subject to opinion. How much practice or training? One day? One lifetime? I mean, define "skillfully done?" Is it like Supreme Court Justice Potter Stewart's take on hardcore pornography, but altered to "I know it when I hear it?" I think a noisy hardcore punk record or a lone repetitive drum machine beat can be skillfully done? Does that make sense to you?

The second definition says "established beyond doubt or dispute." I do disagree here. I don't think anything is established beyond doubt or dispute. You do apparently. Is your argument now about verbs and adjectives? Because mine is not.

We have never stated that less skilled musicians are better as an absolute. That's an insult to the musicians we've featured, technically proficient or otherwise. You read absolutes into statements out of your own ignorance and weird (I'm assuming from various clues that this has something to do with the aging process) insecurities related to music. Is this Chief Kunkle? Even some of the biggest lame-o's I know of thought the Observer show sucked.

I get it, dude. You've seen and heard it all before. Good for you.

And as far as this sentence:

"I would never say a musician who's just played his or her first note hasn't accomplished anything. I think that's a huge accomplishment."

So why earlier today did you theoretically refer to musicians who've played many notes as "unaccomplished?" You didn't address that.

What we've featured on this blog is almost never about skill itself, but what you do with it. We've had all sorts of genre-spanning discussions on here and have featured everything from minamlist composition to prog-jazz-metal whatever.

It's not hypocritical to promote Jazz at The Amsterdam. You're giving me an example of us promoting your definition of an "accomplished musician" on the blog I write for. Do you want to give me more examples of music you approve of plucked from our own posts? I'm sure there are more. That's not exactly helping your argument to basically say, "Damn We Shot JR, you promote all sorts of events! You fucking hypocrites!" If we feature both what you consider accomplished or unaccomplished, what exactly is your fucking point? An accomplished pianist as a concept means nothing to me. A pianist in the context of someone playing jazz at The Amsterdam can be great. Is that a hard concept for you understand? Can the world's musicians seriously be divided into such black and white terms or are you just a complete fucking idiot? "Boor" indeed.

And finally:

"By your "Academy" commercial example, I assumed that the point you were trying to make was that all technically adept musicians are tasteless wankers. I've seen that point made in the past on this blog. Now, you seem to imply it wasn't the point you were trying to make. I think you're being intellectually dishonest. "

You've really seen the point made that all technically adept musicians are tasteless wankers on this blog? That's interesting. I don't seem to recall that exact point being made and I'm pretty familiar with what's been written on this blog. I don't think this is so much about "intellectual dishonesty" as much as it is a problem with someone not being able to understand the nuances of opinion and even more importantly, reading comprehension.

5:12 PM  
Blogger Defensive Listening said...

The Nancarrow example is a good one. Or how about Cecil Taylor, a man who could probably play circles around anybody you would consider "accomplished", but when I'd play his records at a record store I worked at, the unanimous response from people who appreciate technical ability was always, "This is shit."

5:16 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The DO is very comfortable parading the same line-up in the back of its pages week in and out. Why should it ever want stray from its current selections of lickerish tangly bar hoppers?

Someone should dare the DO to write its main local music column about different music, every week, never mentioning the same bands or musicians or djs ... for say ... at least four consecutive weeks, throughout a full year. Is this feasible? Fuck yes it is.
And it would lessen the monotony. But media is a congested and convoluted cocoon of personal friendships and scenes, especially on a local level. So, it ain't gonna happen.

6:31 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Damn, you are defensive, DL. Basically, I thought this blog was calling Shibboleth "crap," so I reacted. You replied that you weren't targeting them, but then you replied with:

I'm starting to catch on to this way of thinking. I mean the other day I saw an Academy Sports commercial, and there was a pretty smokin' guitar solo being played in the background by a very capable musician, and I thought, "If I could just try to play some of those hot licks, I might understand what goes into being someone who might contemplate playing such incredible music."

It seemed that you were saying that the other anon and I were implying that only conventionally skilled musicians are worth a shit, which is not the case for me. If you weren't saying that in the previous statement, then what were you trying to say?

Anyway, since I don't view music that way, I responded. I admit, I was feeling a bit feisty today so wasn't my usual diplomatic self. Now I know where to go when I want to pick an Internet fight.

Proficiency is always subject to opinion. How much practice or training? One day? One lifetime? I mean, define "skillfully done?" Is it like Supreme Court Justice Potter Stewart's take on hardcore pornography, but altered to "I know it when I hear it?" I think a noisy hardcore punk record or a lone repetitive drum machine beat can be skillfully done? Does that make sense to you?

Makes perfect sense.

The second definition says "established beyond doubt or dispute." I do disagree here. I don't think anything is established beyond doubt or dispute. You do apparently. Is your argument now about verbs and adjectives? Because mine is not.

I really don't think the second definition applies to musicians. "Accomplished musician" is a fairly common phrase, and I think the definitions that reference it apply more directly to it. I do accept that certain things are more or less "established beyond doubt or dispute." If I walk outside and water is pouring down from the sky I'm going to accept that it's raining. I know one could delve into certain philosophies and argue the point, but I would just walk away from an argument like that and go about my business. Unless, of course, I have some good reason to believe what's pouring from the sky is not rain.

We have never stated that less skilled musicians are better as an absolute. That's an insult to the musicians we've featured, technically proficient or otherwise. You read absolutes into statements out of your own ignorance and weird (I'm assuming from various clues that this has something to do with the aging process) insecurities related to music. Is this Chief Kunkle? Even some of the biggest lame-o's I know of thought the Observer show sucked.

I get it, dude. You've seen and heard it all before. Good for you.


Again (talk about reading comprehension), I didn't see the whole show and wasn't talking about how good it was or wasn't. I just took issue that you guys had called Shibboleth "crap." You said you weren't targeting Shibboleth. Cool, I accept that and admit I misunderstood what you all were getting at. I haven't seen and heard it all before. I have plenty to learn, which is one reason I return to this site from time to time.

I didn't say it was hypocritical to promote jazz at the Amsterdam. I'm all for you guys promoting whatever. I said it seemed hypocritical to malign all trained pianists as "boring" and then promote shows by some trained musicians. I know he wasn't a pianist, but Miles Davis went to Juilliard. Does that automatically make him "boring"?

Do you want to give me more examples of music you approve of plucked from our own posts?

I don't know exactly what you mean by this. I'm into all kinds of bands and musicians--trained, untrained, self-taught, or whatever. Andres Segovia, Glenn Branca, Elliot Sharp, John Coltrane, Thelonious Monk, the Beatles, the Arcade Fire, Deerhoof, Leadbelly, Faust, Joy Division, Neu, Bad Brains, Slint, The Birthday Party, Jesus Lizard... I could go on forever, but I'll spare you any further name dropping.

What we've featured on this blog is almost never about skill itself, but what you do with it. We've had all sorts of genre-spanning discussions on here and have featured everything from minamlist composition to prog-jazz-metal whatever.

I know, and I applaud you for that. I initially took exception to the Shibboleth thing because I believe they use their skills well. Then, the discussion, spun off from the whole "Academy" thing.

So why earlier today did you theoretically refer to musicians who've played many notes as "unaccomplished?" You didn't address that.

I used "unaccomplished" to mean less technically proficient because "accomplished" when placed before "musician" generally means a technically proficient musician. "Unaccomplished" was probably a bad choice of words because it can be intrepreted as "a lack of accomplishment," which is how you intrepreted it.

Can the world's musicians seriously be divided into such black and white terms or are you just a complete fucking idiot? "Boor" indeed.

No and no. There are innumerable ways to classify musicians, if one must classify them.

MC,

Nancarrow sounds awesome.

Well, it's been fun but I can't waste any more time on this for at least a couple of days. Gots shit to do. So, if you want to keep this going you'll have to wait a couple of days for a reply from me. Take care. Love ya!

10:31 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

That Sarah Reddington show last night was amazing. Those guys are fucking crazy. Everyobdy was good on that bill.

12:04 AM  
Anonymous urn said...

I cannot attest to Shibboleth's performance either way, but SR's earliest point about getting "a couple "supergroups" full of mostly crap musicians to play cover songs and bore the hell out of everyone in between the presentation of awards to other bands that mostly suck," is the true essence of any awards ceremony, be it local or a huge televised event. Either way, it's fucking ridiculous.

Why, for the love of God's blue earth, would a local music awards presentation take even half as long as, say, the Oscars? According to Jasun's frequent DOMA updates on BigDlittled, the awards portion took at least 3 hours, not including people showing up early or hanging out late to mingle.

Being nominees in Tame..Tame And Quiet, we all had no interest in attending this event because (besides the fact that we hadn't a fucking chance) the whole structure of these ceremonies is so needlessly drawn out and draining that it's not a fun prospect by any stretch of the imagination.

I don't want to go see a cover band or bad comic on any other night. Why would I want to sit through hours of it waiting to hear my name once? Possibly? Then what do I say to these strangers? And what good does it do for a group to get up and tell these strangers that they're not the type of category of band they're nominated for at all? They probably didn't know who you were anyhow. If they did, they would have known what you sound like.

If these events were actually meant to celebrate a local music scene, it would be short and sweet; blast through the winners and open up the bar for mingling and whatnot. But they don't. It's a carbon copy of what people think they need to present in an awards ceremony to keep it up to par with what everyone else is doing. Sound familiar?

But in these award ceremony settings, you have to wade through all the "entertainment" awaiting your category. And when you don't win, you leave, because you've been "entertained" out of your mind all night. Rarely will the new factions of bands have a chance to meet with anyone else of the "old guard" because they're not around friends and are generally put off by the whole experience and just want to go home.

I had more, but I'm out of beer and it's late.

To be brief, part of my other query had to do with asking DL what the sore spot with CTR is, as they've been defended vehemently by you in the past. I don't get them either, but like other bands that are not "accomplished" musicians. Can you help explain the attraction? I worded that badly, but hopefully you know what I'm asking for. And it sounds like a Dear Abby question.

4:17 AM  
Blogger Defensive Listening said...

Urn,
To avoid being redundant I wrote this almost a year ago. We have also vehemently defended Ghosthustler, The Undoing Of David Wright, Farah, DJ Nature, The House Of Tinnitus and many that have played there, Eat Avery's Bones, and I defend your band's name out in public all the fucking time. What is your point exactly?

9:39 AM  
Blogger Defensive Listening said...

I mean this:


http://weshotjr.blogspot.com/2006/11/profile-christian-teenage-runaways-by.html

9:41 AM  
Anonymous urn said...

No point. Like I said, it didn't make sense. Don't know why I tagged it on my comment. Should have kept my thoughts to myself. I blame beers.

3:14 PM  

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