The Way We Were
I was bored today, and I thought about this song. I posted it for a couple reasons:
1. I wonder if people think the early 90's were the Dallas music scene "glory days," at least within the past several decades. Is anyone that reads this blog old enough to actually remember the Tripping Daisy, Hagfish, Toadies, etc. era? As in, went to the shows all the time, knew the people in the scene, etc? Does anyone too young to remember care about or like this song? Or this band?
2. when did people stop crowd surfing?
3. I'm not a big Tripping Daisy fan at all, but is it just me or is this song better than those being made by at least 90% of currently active local bands?
4. If so, then how depressing is it that the review on Allmusic said of this album: "Not a landmark album, but not a bad one, either. A pleasant souvenir of its time."
5. Is Dallas producing any "pleasant souvenirs" of THIS time?
1. I wonder if people think the early 90's were the Dallas music scene "glory days," at least within the past several decades. Is anyone that reads this blog old enough to actually remember the Tripping Daisy, Hagfish, Toadies, etc. era? As in, went to the shows all the time, knew the people in the scene, etc? Does anyone too young to remember care about or like this song? Or this band?
2. when did people stop crowd surfing?
3. I'm not a big Tripping Daisy fan at all, but is it just me or is this song better than those being made by at least 90% of currently active local bands?
4. If so, then how depressing is it that the review on Allmusic said of this album: "Not a landmark album, but not a bad one, either. A pleasant souvenir of its time."
5. Is Dallas producing any "pleasant souvenirs" of THIS time?
posted by stonedranger at 3:00 PM
103 Comments:
WORST POST EVER!
Live in the NOW man!
I can't get the shit to play on my wondercomputer, but I do know that being 18 years old in 1992 was a lot of fun. We were all shocked when our underground, that we had JUST found damn it, went mainstream. I mean, I guess it wasn't all that obscure, but we found it honestly and on our own...
Deep Ellum in those days, about the same time as we started driving in from the burbs, was friggin' magic to us. Loved it. Loved pretty much every band we saw, because live music was fucking RAD.
We spent most of our time at Madhatters and The Engine Room and all of Kelly's old bars, but...
It was all fresh. Glory Days? Nah. It's all a cycle. Fun as shit and a great time to be a worked up teenager before cd burners, myspace, blogs, and the internet in general? Fuck yeah.
1) I think "glory days" come around every 20 or so years. Dallas had a great punk scene in the 70s and then it had a good pop/rock scene in the 90s. So, no telling what kind of good scene it will have in the 2010s.
2) First you have to have enough people at a show to actually support a person surfing. Oh snap.
3) I was a Tripping Daisy fan, I admit it, and yes, this song was and still is great. It's nothing but a standard pop song, which usually span over several decades as good music. People want catchy material, something they can sing along to while driving, and this song was damn catchy. I believe some North Texas bands are producing catchy tunes. I'd put this song on a mix tape next to the Tah-Dahs' music any day.
4) It may not be a landmark in the evolution of music, but does every album have to be?
5) It's too early to tell. Give me another 10 or so years to decide.
I was there, it was a sort of golden age, and I dunno about "90%." On what criteria are you basing that judgement? I never really liked those bands then: Hagfish, Toadies, TD. There were, imo, MUCH better bands that never had the quality studio time, distribution, etc. because they were actually producing interesting music, and not just pleasant souvenirs of their era... BillyGoat, Earl Harvin Trio, Ten Hands, Dooms UK, Uncle Grizzly, slobberbone, the phelps brothers, bogoblin, the grown ups, baboon, brutal juice, sivad, the oddfellows, ghostcar, all the space rock weirdness... wait are you asking about "Dallas" bands? or just "North Texas" bands? because most of the good music back then was coming out of Denton.
I meant Dallas bands in the last part. And whats with all the beach balls?
crowd surfing would entail having people look up off the ground and away from their shoes and not having their arms folded and not standing 10 feet away from the stage. a brother could break his neck trying to crowd surf at an INDIE KID show
not to mention at that time, dallas had bedhead going on. (for you younger hipsters, that was a band, not the toni and guy hair products you may be thinking of...)
anyways, they earned a ton of respect from a lot of credible indie hereos like steve albini.
so, it wasn't just the young triping daisy fans who had something to pogo dance about, but the pretentious hipster college kids had something to stand back, fold their arms and look down to as well..
everyone was happy.
so there were actually hip kids at SMU at one time?
PREDECTION:
CURRENT AND NEWER LOCAL AREA BANDS, WHO COULD POTENTIALLY PUT NORTH TEXAS MUSIC BACK ON THE MAP. EACH REPRESENTING A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT GENRE: (IN NO PARTICULAR ORDER)
VOOT CHA INDEX, PAPER CHASE, WASHING MACHINE, PEGASUS NOW, SHINY AROUND THE EDGES, THE THEATER FIRE, TAH DAHS, THE BAPTIST GENERALS AND MIDLAKE.
This is just my opinion, but i think all these bands, depending on how they handle their business, release records etc, are making some pretty fucking exciting music that could do well on a national / international level.
I agree. That is kind of what I was trying to get at without really saying so.
you know, there's always been a few smu hipsters out there...
but back then, there was this lull between the time the argo closed and rubbergloves opened in denton. all the denton kids would decend upon dallas for each and every bedhead show.
that may have been the last dallas band to ever earn the respect of the denton kids...
they have refined pallets :)
dispite being too young to go to shows at the time, i've listened to Tripping Daisy since their first album (bill).... i'd say that the first 3 albums were just radio pop on something mildly hallucinagenic (no, i cannot and will not spell).... but i'd be lying if i didn't say that i thought the last two albums weren't brilliant.... i was VERY moved by "Jesus Hits..." and think the main reason that that album isn't more talked about as something really special (on a national scale) was their whole deal w/ the record company (island drops them right after (or was it before) they finish up that album... by far their best)
also, somebody said they thought the Tah Dahs could get some national recognition... you can say that and leave out The Undoing of David Wright? what about the strange boys.... i mean, first off... these are young guys, the dude from the tah-dahs is going to have some trouble staying relevant for long enough to make a national impact.... 6 years down the road and that fuckers a bald guy w/ kids in highschool (ok, maybe not highschool)... i'm not saying it's not good...
also, i remember hagfish... were they actually taken seriously? i mean, i was young when i heard "rocks your lame ass" but IMO that shit was only a little better than Bowling for Soup (who totaly blow ass).... i mean, it was funny when i was in 7th grade and just learned what he meant when he sang "will you eat my box while i work? eat it while i work"
...but i don't know that they had any sort of undeniable brilliance
....blink one-eighty-rancid
so i got a little contraction crazy when i said "i'd be lying if i didn't say that i thought the last two albums weren't brilliant"
probably shoulda been "i'd be lying if i said that i didn't think the last two albums were brilliant"
....someone get me the fuck out of this store.
I've seen some great shows in my day, but I will never forget the Course of Empire shows from that same period. I had religious experiences at those shows, similar to what I had a year or two ago at Sigur Ros. I guess it's just not "cool" to put on a big rock show anymore and expect people to consider it intellectual. Not that I'm implying that Tripping Daisy was a thinking man's band. Their albums did end up getting pretty interesting.
Confession: I bought a Pop Poppins CD online only a few days ago. Waiting for the shame to kick in.
PREDICTIONs.. in addition -
forgotten for now but not gone : jetscreamer in the house, 2007. starhead was a great release for putting texas in general as well as north texas on the international music map. it just never got noticed here due to label/distro mess ups. too bad.
feels weird to say that, because i'm not the type to talk about our accomplishments, but i think it's okay to say 'hey, we did this'
i hope some of you out there will pull for us to do it again.
agree with you about most of those bands, but i think even more than that are capable (. it's really all in who gets the luck of the draw. just one example: if the angelus could get a label to simply put out a recording and promote the hell out of it, make sure everything is in order distro wise, and actually back up their band, then they could be huge. mybe not here, but uk and europe would lap out of those four's hands. and on.
mandarin put us on the map, but no label support. and bla blah blah.
90s music was fun - i think streisand and scott are both right about dallas.
i will hold strong for the magic of denton, though.
and did you mean Uncle Grizzly or did you mean to say Little Grizzly?
ANON - POP POPPINS
i found some old pics from way back when of me and the Pop Poppins guys at the Hastings in Sherman. that could be shame but screw it, i refuse!
Hagfish - Thurston Moore flew in to see them. to me, that's HUGE (beyond really)
ufofu, loveswing, rubberbullet...HAHAHA
I know something you don't know, but soon you will all know. Bring on the hate.
FUNLAND!
Course of Empire really was one of the most amazing live show I ever saw. I wish some the current batch of local bands were that ambitious and larger than life. The records were okay, but live they were a real force. Most of the good stuff did come from Denton back then though.
whataboutthepolyphonicspree
the commenters on this blog are so fucking predictable.
jesus hits like the atom bomb is better than anything that's ever come out of denton. deal with it.
Jesus hits is an OK Flaming Lips knockoff. If you really think that was better than the stuff coming out of Denton it's only because you probably did not pay attention to the stuff coming out of Denton.
I am bummed I never got to see Lift to Experience. Had to work when they were in L.A.
I did, however, see the Toadies' last L.A. show. It was so intense, I literally walked out questioning my existence and quit my job soon afterward.
We now finally live in a state where it is encouraged for one to play guitar on a regular basis, whether or not it will ever be relevant to anyone other than ourselves.
God Bless Texas.
M-.
Sub Oslo, Comet, Mazinga Phaser, Light Bright Highway, Good Bad Art Collective, Earl Harvin, Slobberbone, Centromatic, Pointy Shoe Factory, Skiptracer, Riverboat Gamblers Greenella,Lift to Experience, Thorazine Dreams, Sivad, The Oddfellows and even though I am not a fan Tripping Daisy(I dig Polyphonic Spree alright though despite the super happiness) even started in Denton. there are many more where that came from. I have to agree with anon above if you really believe the "jesus" record was the end all be all it's because you were not paying attention and up until recently The Observer tended to overlook most Denton and indie bands on a routine basis.
Even bands like MK Ultra and Transona 5 had to go to Denton to find an audience. Things were different back then. I think balance of good and interesting bands between Dallas and Denton bands is far more balanced nowadays. Both towns have a lot to offer as far as good local music goes. If you are gonna make a statement like that I hope you can back it up by actually being able to say you saw all of the bands active at the time.
bring on the hate.
yeah, i was around to see those bands, and i'm not hating.
there's a reason no one remembers them, and a reason no one cares about mazinga phaser. like it or not, they're irrelevant.
mwanza was very influential...hell he was the reason argo was so successful. I got into hawkwind because of mwanza.
Actually, I think the mid/late80s, before people smelled money in Deep Ellum, was its glory time.
When people gathered in the Theatre Gallery under a hanging lightbulb overhead, brought their own beer, and froze their asses off.....just to come hear bands. You know, before people's egos got the best of them, and it became a 'scene'.
Sadly, that shit only happens once in any particular place.
If no one cares then why is my band doing so well. Come on don't be anonymous let see who the haters are. If my bands are cool enough for Glenn Branca, Simeon from Silver Apples, Sonic Boom, Fuxa, Bardo Pond , my many overseas friends on soulseek and countless other friends I have made over the years. I think I am doing alright enough. Never had an interest in fame or fortune anyways.
Whoever you are I must have really pissed you off. For that I am sorry. I don't think my bands are all that. My ego is not what you guys keep portraying. I do think I have something to offer. If you have that much of a problem with me why don't you not be a coward and tell me to my face. I'm a pretty laidback and generally nice guy just living my life and making my art. I'm poor but happy and genrally get a lot more respect than disrepect. So if your gonna make such vicious attacks Mr. Anon. Be a man(or woman)and step up. who are ya? A sour ex-bandmate maybe? Ex-girlfriend? Somebody I would not book at the argo enough? You have something personal against me and your posts are making me stronger.
Bring on the hate HEHEHEHE!!!!!
HERE IS A LITTLE ADVICE FROM NINA SIMONE=============
And now we got a revolution
Cause i see the face of things to come
Yeah, your Constitution
Well, my friend, its gonna have to bend
Im here to tell you about destruction
Of all the evil that will have to end.
Some folks are gonna get the notion
I know theyll say im preachin hate
but if i have to swim the ocean
well i would just to communicate
its not as simple as talkin jive
the daily struggle just to stay alive
Singin about a revolution
because were talkin about a change
its more than just evolution
well you know you got to clean your brain
the only way that we can stand in fact
is when you get your foot off our back
Tripping Daisy??! The 90's were the glory days?! Nuts to that!
I was too young for the Theater Gallery, but anyone in their teens who grew up in Dallas in the early 90's worth their salt knew that Common Ground/Slipped Disk was where it was at.
It was dirty, it was rundown, it was by Parkland, it stole electricity, but when you're under 18 and want to see a live show every weekend from local and road acts, that was the place to be.
As for Hagfish, they started at Common Ground playing Descendents covers.
The Argo, was a damn good venue with a ton of great shows. It's a shame it didn't last long.
damn.. personal shizzit steppin' in. wanz don't care about no haters bogging him down, cause he's better than that. and people do care, did care, at least here in this little town. our past was the road to our present. hizzah
ok, here's a question... if "jesus hits..." is "not the end all be all" (and i don't mean to ONLY incite Mwanza here... and i am not attempting to "hate" in any way)... which ALBUMS from the area and of the time were??
mind you... i DID NOT say "which bands" b/c i can't go order/buy/download concerts from back then... i'm asking "which albums" (and, yes.. it would help if you could mention who made the album).
because i'm not trying to say that tripping daisy were the only band that mattered back then, or that they were the only one worth a damn... i was way too young to go to shows let alone the fact that i don't have any older siblings who could have told me of some cool local acts (in other words... i had limited resources at the time).... "jesus hits like the atom bomb" was the first local album that i can remember thinking was just as good as everything else i was listening to at the time (if not much better than a lot of it)
...am i saying that i was listening to nothing but great music? no... but my taste wasn't terrible.
so who's got some dallas/denton/area "lost gem" albums that us kids should check out?
This is the best album ever recorded by a dallas band that WAS NEVER RELEASED:
http://climate.bryanscabin.com/sounds/final/index.html
I'll be back later to pick apart this whole topic.
Seriously, that Climate stuff sounds like it would provide the most boring live show ever. How can that even be in the same blog as Course of Empire and Lift to Experience?
One of the best shows I ever saw was at Argo... Tortoise played and they kept switching instruments and dancing around like maniacs on the vibraphone. It was amazing! I had only heard their self-titled release so I really didn't know what to expect. It was truly a religious experience... I drove back to Dallas that night trying to figure out if someone slipped me something in my drink. wow!
people always look back on past times as a greater period for music than the one they currently are in.
I think there are great things happening now and we are on the cusp perhaps of even better things...
I never was a big fan of that time period here... I was listening to very different stuff... detroit techno, early industrial, late 70s and 80s electronic and ambient, good hip-hop, some rock but I was in a period of rebellion against rock and roll.
Yes, how dare Climate be lumped in with the Denton equivalent of the Swirlies and the Dallas equivalent of Gravity Kills. Thanks for posting that link, Asshole.
Speaking of Equivalents. This is my favorite game:
1. Tripping Daisy:Flaming Lips (if they were talentless and had no punk roots) Listen to "Gotta Girl" and see if you don't feel stupid about ten seconds into it.
2. Toadies:Marcy's Playground. Vogeler should be tried in an International War Crimes tribunal for crimes against humanity in Funland.
3. Tah-Dahs:Any Elephant 6 band. Except Shittier. And I hate Elephant 6. Same thing goes for the forgotten "Good Umbrella" concept. Age has nothing to do with them (Tah-Dahs) making it or not. There are some pretty successful and aged bands around here. You don't have to be that old to have a kid. Some of your favorite young bands might have kids.
4. Paper Chase:This one is complicated, just like they like it. Like when an eighth grader who's into industrial pop (see Course of Empire) makes his "dark" photographs all "fucked up" in Photoshop. Take the more annoying parts of Drive Like Jehu and mix them with a cartoonish and amateur version of Steve Albini's guitar and recording sound. Top it off with the most contrived vocals of all time. So bad I go back every six months to see if they are as really bad as I remember....Yep, they are. And they are associated (cellist/turns bad eighth grade artwork into music videos) with, to put it nicely, the most unfriendly booking agent ever to work in DFW. Also, bass player has a five-string.
5. Midlake:Fourth rate Coldplay B-sides. Almost Travis territory.
6. Baptist Generals:Counting Crows recorded on a walkman. Ever notice how all reviews of bands from here talk about how Texan everything sounds? They are so TEXAN. That muffled musical saw was extremely Texan. Those backing vocals evoke the big, endless sky over Texas. Why don't I ever read reviews that say, "Wait 'til you get a load of that distorted New Hampshirean bass playing!"
7. Hagfish:Reel Big Fish (without the ska). Nice guys, but where do I begin? Suits on stage and they were kind of Pop Punk. Yeah, the good old days. Also, the King of pretentious scenesters flew all the way to Dallas to see them. Hmm, I guess Glenn Branca has a taste for those types. He builds big "guitarmies" with them. Rhys Chatham is better and came first.
8. Pointy Shoe Factory:Placebo and other assorted misappropriations of Goth culture.
9. Centro-Matic:Guided by Voices ripoff band in the early days. Lately, more like an illiterate Will Oldham. WIll Johnson should be tried in an international War Crimes Tribunal for Crimes against Humanity in Funland. I'll throw it in here, Peter Schmidt should be found "Not Guilty" for Funland but then put on trial for LCC. Josh Venable should be tossed in for guilt by association. And ramming them down your throat in the early part of this decade. Man, whatever happened to Kevin on the Adventure Club?
He played Rapeman and Husker Du. Unthinkable today. Probably even on KNTU.
10. Sub Oslo:Respectable men, but only band I have ever fallen asleep watching while standing straight up. SCENE CRED:1998 Orbit room show opening up for June of Forty Bore. Bet you were there, Wanz. You really saw all those bands play? Wow, you've been to a lot of bad shows. You were booking the Argo and you're going to hold it over other people's heads if they weren't there at the time. Some people were probably too busy going to middle school to give a shit about being there when all the truly great local bands were playing. I'm not one of them. I didn't see a lot of the bands you mentioned "Blixa" (ooh, Einsturzende Neubauten reference? Cool. Oh wait, you just like him because he played with the Australian Tom Waits. Same goes for your Nicki Sudden tribute. You sum up his career by stating he made (one of his worst) records with Roland S. Howard? Boring.) I could have seen all of the bands you mentioned. I'm just old enough. I even saw some of them on accident. I've heard them all. I didn't have to be there. Most of them sucked. You also lose points for mentioning your own band every other post.
11.Polyphonic Spree:Like Danielson Famile with three times as many members but 1/100th of their charm, genius, and songwriting ability. And if they worshipped Volkswagons, Ipods, and Satan instead of God. Remember when the Observer wrote an article asking why they weren't famous enough? And you guys just sit around and let that happen? That should have been an invitation to riot.
And as for Dallas bands that command respect from Denton? For starters, who gives a fuck? But I can think of a few. Everyone here is so concerned with bands breaking out in the world. Why do you fucking care? Why can't you be glad that you like their music? Let that be enough. Does every shit project around here have to be on a
label? Or be a "National Act"? A lot of bands I listed did that. Does that make them good? In the Dallas/Denton music scene, nine times out of ten, that's how I can tell a band will probably suck. I think, "Oh, they duped a label into thinking their schtick is authentic and worthy of release. That's pretty good, but too bad they suck." It's a business deal. It says nothing of the quality. Somebody thinks they can sell it. William Hung and My Chemical Romance are on labels too. I guess I consider it some sort of an accomplishment but it doesn't make me like their fucking horrible music any more. I wish I could wake up tomorrow and the bands I listed were all from somewhere else. Then I wouldn't get pegged as an across the board "Dallas/Denton music hater". I probably hate even more national acts, now that I think about it. There are a lot of bands from around here. Not the same ten to fifteen you keep mentioning. Some of them I love with all my heart. As for the people who brag about accomplishments on here, I even like some of you or at least respect you. But I think it's in bad taste. Simeon from Silver Apples is totally respectable but who cares if he liked Mazinga. Take enough acid and you'll like anything "Trippy".
I want the younger posters on here to know, you didn't miss anything. Don't listen to these old fuckers. Don't even listen to me if you don't want to. But I think most of these young bands are right fucking on. Stomp on the graves of Space Rockers, Post Rockers, and Alterna-Pop Shitheads of the Nineties. Fucking end that era. It's natural and it's your right. You don't owe anybody a thing. If they're bitter and old, they blew it. They had their chance. Some of them would even have a chance now, if they'd stop bragging about their local importance, find some humility and just get on with their aspirations. I want the older crowd on here to know, there is a side to the DFW music scene that either you don't know exists or you don't acknowledge. We've been around the block, seen a lot of the shows you've seen, have some of the same influences etc. But we don't wear the same rose tinted and nostalgia-obsessed glasses you do. I've sat here bored for over a decade. And I'm glad that things have changed the way they have. Fuck the Argo. Fuck the Orbit Room. Fuck Deep Ellum. Fuck 1990's Denton. I saw it. It's irrelevant. It's gone. You don't get respect by demanding it. You get it by earning it. Maybe you've only earned it in your own eyes. Don't expect everyone else to see things your way.
If my post seemed especially nasty, it's because there is a level of smugness from some of these scene veterans that is very disturbing. They should be more encouraging and less self-congratulatory.
These are just opinions and I'm trying to make light of a lot of these sacred cows. Take it lightly. Peace.
whataboutthebroncobowl
um, email Weshotjr@yahoo.com now please.
I just spent five minutes laughing my ass off.
who do you want to email you?
wow that was the best post i think i have seen on this board yet....hahhhahahahhahahahhahahahhahahahahahaaaahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah
the person that made the long funny list post at 933.
and thats just it by the way...
I didn't agree with everything that guy (or girl) said. I just thought it was extremely well written.
Never make light of the Toadies.
M-.
i bet there are a lot of bands from around here who are glad for once, that their band's name was not mentioned in a weshotjr post!
anon, you pretty much hit the nail on the head, even if i don't agree with a couple of your local band critiques, for the most part, you are right on.
i think you just ended all music blogs...
Equating Deep Blue Something with the Toadies?!
Surely, I am not the only one here who is a die hard fan of the Toadies?
Surely?!
I know I was in PA and CA for their existance and only visited TX during those years, but what gives? Why the haterade? I flat-out love their albums start to finish, and their show was literally life changing.
Eh... someone please elaborate.
And, I'll tell you about my old best friend's Tripping Daisy show experience in PA.
Rock!
M-.
scuse me for actually liking my own band. I make the music because I like it. If you don't dig your own art what is the point. No points lost. One of the reasons Mazinga originally split was because I spent more time promoting other bands than my own. as far as the bands being better back in the old days......I don't completely agree with that. The vibe was definatel a lot more friendly. The best bands of those time never widely records.
I'm curious. Is there anything I could post on here that would not end up with someone taking yet another anonymous shot at me. Does anyone have the spine to let me know who has sucj little respect for me. At least people know where I stand. No fakeness here. For better or worse. You can keep dissing on me and I will keeping helping the scene. I am doing the right thing and have been for over a decade. Supporting underdog underground artists. If you don't like it the keep being part of the problem. See Nina Simone lyrics from before. You will lose.
"The first lesson a revolutionary must learn is that he is a doomed man."
"There's no reason for the establishment to fear me. But it has every right to fear the people collectively - I am one with the people."
-Huey Newton
Yes those are both quotnoes from a Black Panther. Don't be cowards. If you got shit to say then don't hide. At least everyone knows where I stand.
As far as Pointy Shoe factory goes.....They were making fun of Goth. If you paid attention then you
got the Joke.
BRING ON THE HATE?
hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheheh
I don't think people should feel the need to come right out and say who they are on here... the whole point is that they don't have to.
But I should say, it seems like Wanz has brought some of these attacks on himself, but it also seems that no matter what he says on here, someone will attack him, whether he is being nice or an asshole. I can honestly say that I haven't seen him be much of an asshole on here, or at least to any greater degree than the people attacking him have been.
Wanz, I guess thats just the name of the game. For every post I make on here, I'm sure there is at least one person that hates it and at least one person that loves it.
Same with you. There seem to be a lot of people that like you on here, and a lot of people that don't. It is mainly because a lot of people know you, and thus there are a lot of opinions about you. Brush it off man.
I think a lively discussion of the issues brought up here is valid. I really don't think personal attacks on anyone posted are necessary, frankly.
I don't think Wanz has said anything that has made him an asshole. He hasn't attacked anyone, yet he's been repeatedly attacked. Seems like he's been rather respectful.
The people attacking me don't know me. If they did they would not attack me. I may be opionated, but I don't go around hating on people. As far as calling out The cowards. I was kind of hoping that if they really mean what they say that they could write me personally and I can either apoligize for doing whatever I did to them or agree to just steer clear. I am afraid that some of these people are folks that I am polite to in public. I suspect some backstabbing going on. Everyone I don't like knows it.........and that is not very many people. And a good chunk of those people that I don't like are ex-skinheads. The one thing I hated most about "the old days".........too many Skinheads.
Wanz:
Once again, you take things too personally. I actually don't dislike you and I've mentioned before that I respect you. I'm just choosing to take issue with some of the attitudes and statements made here, like I would with anyone. To quote the Black Panthers in response to a humorous post I made about local music is a little over the top, but okay. And as far as helping the underdog, I'm sure you've done a lot for people in your scene. But you've never helped anyone I know, they don't need anyone's help. And in the closing of my statement I mentioned the part of the scene (i hate that word) that you either don't acknowledge or even know about. They are the true underdogs. People that don't see their names in print all the time. Because they don't care. They don't mail all of their albums and cdr's to the observer or whatever. Not everyone is looking for approval with every little musical journey they embark on. Some people actually make music just to do it. I know that's a cliche or impossible for you to believe. And some of them find success that way. But once again, they earn it. They don't just expect it or ask for it, or get on their knees for it. I don't think I'm "part of the problem". I (and most folks in bands I've known) don't ask for anything from anybody and have done just fine. I've always known who you are and what you do. But you haven't always known us. The difference between us and you is we don't care if you know us or not. We don't need this credit or approval that you seem to seek. As for being a coward and hiding, read all the posts about it on here. You're posting on a blog written by someone who is anonymous. You post your name and are surprised when other people discuss you anonymously. That doesn't make much sense to me. When Stonedranger listed music he listened to lately, you said you can't believe you haven't run into each other because you both like the same electronic record. This perfectly sums up what I think is a kind of insular world view. You and I probably both like a lot of the same records. Why didn't I see you in 2000 at Good Records when I bought that ESG reissue on Soul Jazz? Man, we should have both been reaching for it at the same time! See how ridiculous that sounds? You think you and your little crowd are the only people who know anything about anything around here. I just think that's an inflated view of one's self. There are eight million people in DFW. Some of them like obscure electronic records. Some of them toured all over the world. Some of them have associated with Indie Rock celebrities just like you have. I know a lot of these people. They are not on this board tooting their own horn. You never introduced any of them to a single record. You didn't book their tours. They don't have you to thank for anything. They are not part of the problem. The only problem around here is the disconnect in reality between how you think things are and how they actually are.
Woah, watch it there Wanz. Definitely not a skinhead. I'm not even white.
dear old self-congradulatory (good word choise early-anon):
"Yeah, I'm losing my edge.
I'm losing my edge.
The kids are coming up from behind.
I'm losing my edge.
I'm losing my edge to the kids from France and from London.
But I was there.
I was there in 1968.
I was there at the first Can show in Cologne.
I'm losing my edge.
I'm losing my edge to the kids whose footsteps I hear when they get on the decks.
I'm losing my edge to the Internet seekers who can tell me every member of every good group from 1962 to 1978.
I'm losing my edge.
To all the kids in Tokyo and Berlin.
I'm losing my edge to the art-school Brooklynites in little jackets and borrowed nostalgia for the unremembered eighties.
But I'm losing my edge.
I'm losing my edge, but I was there.
I was there.
But I was there.
I'm losing my edge.
I'm losing my edge.
I can hear the footsteps every night on the decks.
But I was there.
I was there in 1974 at the first Suicide practices in a loft in New York City.
I was working on the organ sounds with much patience.
I was there when Captain Beefheart started up his first band.
I told him, "Don't do it that way. You'll never make a dime."
I was there.
I was the first guy playing Daft Punk to the rock kids.
I played it at CBGB's.
Everybody thought I was crazy.
We all know.
I was there.
I was there.
I've never been wrong.
I used to work in the record store.
I had everything before anyone.
I was there in the Paradise Garage DJ booth with Larry Levan.
I was there in Jamaica during the great sound clashes.
I woke up naked on the beach in Ibiza in 1988.
But I'm losing my edge to better-looking people with better ideas and more talent.
And they're actually really, really nice.
I'm losing my edge.
I heard you have a compilation of every good song ever done by anybody. Every great song by the Beach Boys. All the underground hits. All the Modern Lovers tracks. I heard you have a vinyl of every Niagra record on German import. I heard that you have a white label of every seminal Detroit techno hit - 1985, '86, '87. I heard that you have a CD compilation of every good '60s cut and another box set from the '70s.
I hear you're buying a synthesizer and an arpeggiator and are throwing your computer out the window because you want to make something real. You want to make a Yaz record.
I hear that you and your band have sold your guitars and bought turntables.
I hear that you and your band have sold your turntables and bought guitars.
I hear everybody that you know is more relevant than everybody that I know.
But have you seen my records? This Heat, Pere Ubu, Outsiders, Nation of Ulysses, Mars, The Trojans, The Black Dice, Todd Terry, the Germs, Section 25, Althea and Donna, Sexual Harrassment, a-ha, Pere Ubu, Dorothy Ashby, PIL, the Fania All-Stars, the Bar-Kays, the Human League, the Normal, Lou Reed, Scott Walker, Monks, Niagra,
Joy Division, Lower 48, the Association, Sun Ra,
Scientists, Royal Trux, 10cc,
Eric B. and Rakim, Index, Basic Channel, Soulsonic Force ("just hit me"!), Juan Atkins, David Axelrod, Electric Prunes, Gil! Scott! Heron!, the Slits, Faust, Mantronix, Pharaoh Sanders and the Fire Engines, the Swans, the Soft Cell, the Sonics, the Sonics, the Sonics, the Sonics.
You don't know what you really want. (x15)"
um...i wouldn't brag about that list of records there,buddy..
sounds like mainstream indie shit to me...now,have you seen wanz's
records?
sounds like LCD Soundsystem to me
great song.
If anyone is curious to hear some truly great local music go check ou Unconscious Collective @ The Kettle this Friday. These guys are awesome.
dear mr anon. I don't ask for approval of my own art. I don't need it. If you are to elitist to want to hook up and turn each other on to music that is your problem. I don't have a group of friends. I know a lot of people because I have been around a long time. I am mostly a loner. I know I should not do the namedrop/resume game, but I don't believe in letting people attack me and not defending myself, but I will try to hold back. I posted "Liars Rule" and someone felt like that was enough to take a shot at me. I just don't understand. To quote my myspace profile
"I am socially awkward and would rather play music than socialize most of the time."
I'm just a music geek that listens to too much NPR with bad social skills. Is that really a crime.
Mr. anon was funny, but still misses the point. There is a lot of good music from the "old days" and a lot of good music now. The problems from then are the same as now. No Unity. Lots of backstabbing. Get off the elitist indie throne. Put you money where your mouth is. Go do something positive to support your local starving artist.........or not.
yes, that was LCD Soundsystem... and clearly it wasn't supposed to make me (the poster) look cool... it was supposed to say the same thing we're all saying about the older guys around here who keep thinking they deserve something from the new people b/c they came before... i don't disagree that you should feel deserving... but you're really not... you're "loosing your edge" to a newer group of people who are using the same ideas to make new music....... the song just seemed relevant... you want to say "hey wait... i was there back when deep ellum was cool" and that's great... i like hearing about what it used to be like, but that has prescious little to do w/ what is going on now... younger people w/ "better ideas and more tallent" are taking over... "and they're really really nice people"
... clearly it wasn't me trying to compete.. i'm trying to say SO FUCKING WHAT? we move on, we grow, things change, you adapt... such is life.
i mean, if any of you guys went to small town texas public schools then you probably know 3 or 4 guys who were on the "best football team ____ highschool had ever seen"... and that's all they talk about, all they want credit for, and they have done nothing else... look, that's AWESOME... but what are you doing now? that's what matters (and i'm not saying that b/c the persons this is directed toward are doing NOTHING but b/c i don't like the idea that what you did in 1994 should matter to me more than what you're doing now... unless you're the dallas texas version of Lou Reed (and there is none) then i don't care... i like knowing what went on then, but i'm not making mental note of who deserves the credit for it)
wanz,
i think this mr.anon is someone that you know well and has some
obvious built up aggression..could even be a she
if we're all looking for something/someone to pick out,how about this?
-getting spam fr.bands begging me to vote for them for a silly observer award?where's the humility?
it's like these people are running a big bicycle race.i play music because I HAVE TO-It's taken me 33 years of hell to document what i do now-
itjust cannot be summed up to an simple award,goddamnit
I see nothing in any of Wanz's posts that claims that he is any cooler than the younger generation of bands. He does not know me, but I met him at the sanctuary once. He seemed like a nice guy and he was there to see new bands. I don't see why so many people hate him so much.
Dear Anon sleuth at 12:39 pm:
I'm glad you've been brushing up on your Nancy Drew. There are many "Anons" on here. Wanz has said enough about himself on here. I don't think there has to be some huge personal backstory. He's been telling us his backstory here for weeks now. I've actually never been formally introduced to Wanz. I believe we may or may not have played on the same bill but I don't think it was more than once. That doesn't account for (much angrier) comments others have made. I have no built up aggression, I was merely responding to comments made around this blog. My built up aggression is towards a stagnant and mediocre music scene trying to extend itself into the more exciting current underground scene like it has a God given right. Good luck on your detective work.
if yr built up agression is on a stagnant blah blah scene then direct it to EVERYONE here...
unbelievable,words that people twist around.
this discussion is over-
I like ice cream, do you?
i'll have to agree with the VOTE FOR ME FOR SCHOOL PRESIDENT OR BEST BAND FOR OBSERVER. stop that. Stop asking people to vote for you. Stop spamming for people to vote for you.
me too.
and I should clarify... based on my interactions, I dig both the girl that does Lollipop and the guy that does the Smoke. And I like the music they play. Its just that the attitudes of some of these "mods" that hang out at said events are beyond idiotic.
yeah,quick change the subject
Streisand --
Wow, you dug up that overblown article I wrote many years ago for the Chronicle ... and even then it was several years after the first Melodica.
I think I've learned a lot about writing since then (less is more mostly), but even today it stands as one of my favorite experiences (musical or otherwise) ... and I've had almost as many as the dude who was at the first Can show
i thought that mod revival shit was over a few years ago .... is that how long it takes stuff to get up here?
bub, what bands are you speaking of? just curious...
hmm. light bright highway. i forgot about those guys... anyone mind if i reminisce? argo's big ass beer night. the good/bad's band wrestling match at the argo? corn mo and mauve oed? i even saw some good shows at rick's before it burned down. hell, i remember when karma wasnt even there. it was a smoke shop. and before Dennis bought zebra's head. I watched the delta lodge burn to the ground. Rubber gloves was BYOB and awesome. the food at dans bar was kick ass. So was the little cafe in voyager's dream. Mr Gattis on the square. I saw hagfish at The Hop in fort worth and i thought they sucked, it was the first time i saw a band spit at their audience. what was that reggae club there? the freedom club, thats it. fort worth rastafarians. the toadies at mad hatters. those were the days. the prophet bar. the video bar. the home bar. the old poor david's pub. the kick ass coffee shop next to trees. the bronco bowl. The Arcadia Theater. the whole scene was cool then, but its actually a lot cooler now. the internet has made it possible to check out bands before you go to a show, the venues mostly have better sound, the people are mostly nicer and less arrogant. The bands are more interesting, there are less skinheads and fights. I'm in my 30's and i see way more music than i did when i was in my early twenties. I am trying to do more for the bands than i ever have, and it feels great and i love seeing the people who have stuck around. I knew wanz when he was a freshman at UNT. scotthop sold me tickets to the first lollapalooza. I used to marvel at seeing Paul Slavens play improv sets at the Dogstar Cafe in Fort Worth, and now he's on my radio every sunday night. I used to listen to Clebo Rainey read poetry at the slams at chumleys. man i miss chumleys.
but i wouldnt trade any of it for the cool stuff going on now.
now we have yellow house shows, 1919 hemphill, Spiral Diner, ave arts, jupiter house, haileys, rgrs is still pretty cool. dan's silverleaf, J&J's, The Cavern, weshotjr, midlake, bosque brown, shiny around the edges, notes from the underground, swirve, Record Hop, Warren Jackson Hearne, The Angelus, the undoing of david wright, zipzipzapzap, good records, Fishboy, sarah reddington, 100 damned guns, double wide, wreck room, the chimeneas...
yeah, it was great, but those places and those bands have moved on and been replaced by equally great things. i wouldnt trade it.
oh shit, another relic of those days: salim...
he had long, jet-black crystal gail hair. dressed in a trenchcoat, john lennon glasses and a spanish catholic priest's hat.
to top it off, he would point fans at himself to make his hair and trenchcoat dance in the circulating breeze wafting around him..
man, those were some dark days, really. how could there be any comparison between now and then?
oh yeah, salim's band was called the moon festival.
yeeesh, i get embarrassed just thinking about them..
Desert City Sleeps was one of the highlights of Tales From the Edge volume 3
Oh, the Mod thing bugs some people eh? How cute.
It's not like Mods have overrun Dallas. It would be a nice change of pace though considering the lameasses that infest this town.
Honestly, if you are going to bitch about the state of things in Dallas then why bitch about people doing something a bit different?
You may not like it, you may not get it, but that's your problem. Some of us don't need our marching orders from mainstream music press nor Pitchfork media. Obviously plenty of people seem to like it, I've always been interested in it since I was a teenager, and seeing the people that come out and dance and dress in sharp clothes makes me happy.
As for Wanz, I may not get out to his events but he's the hardest working guy in town and he's never acted like he's above everyone else to me so he has my total respect.
As for Bub, who is bugged by the Mods, I remember Dunebuggy Headquarters. I saw a few good shows there. I also remember being happy leaving the beer store down the street alive after going through a sea of Gs standing outside shooting darts from their eyes at our shavedheads and boots.
to jason..
this is funny.dressing sharp?dancing?doing something new?
that goes on in any local meat market dance club.you guys should just take it to that one club lush-
you have no buisness in an ART venue.oh wait,there are no art venues here.
where does the money go you guys charge for cover?
Where does the money go to? It goes to pay the bills to keep Avenue Arts open, that's where. It's not like anyone is raking in any sort of profits.
I would go to Lush but there are too many Asians there, and you know what they say: Asians are the last to know about something, so once they show up, the place has been placed out. I'm trying to be one step ahead.
The place is called Avenue Arts venue. I'm not claiming anything I do is art, but then again, it seems there are plenty of snake oil merchants in this town that try to pass shit off as art.
So let's hear about your story anon. One of those kiddies that found indie rock in college? It's the devil's music...
bub,
First off, you'll never catch me with a skinny tie.
Second, if you're band played Dunebuggy HQ you might be a fuddyduddy, but maybe you aren't. You gave your opinion, so I'm giving mine. Action-reaction. You take a swipe, I take a swipe. Simple as that.
Third, The Smoke isn't a 'Theme party'. The Mod scene internationally never died out. It's a consistent subculture that's always been there, re-invented itself, and it will probably be there when I've gone off to play family man. I enjoy the music and to wear good clothes, and the people who come seem to have a good time, and that makes me feel good, so that's all that matters.
It's something some of us have always had an interest in since we were teens and we've stuck to it.
As I said, we don't need Pitchfork or some music rag to tell me or the people I know what's in or what's out.
Not to toot my own horn, but if Indie music wasn't so 'safe' these days, I wonder just how many of the cynical half-wits out there, that like to throw out their two-cents, would even be around. They'd probably be boasting about how they saw the Pussycat Dolls before they became big instead.
ah,a racist mod eh?
wow! i can't believe some douche bag just got on here and wrote PARAGRAPHS defending his choice to be mod!
"It's something some of us have always had an interest in since we were teens and we've stuck to it."
man, way to stick to it! after all these years of adversity and being tormented for your mod beliefs, you can still hold your mop-top head up high!
seriously, anono-mod, find somehting worthwhile to devote your pathetic life to and stop embarrasing yourself and your parents....
Bub,
If it's not your cup of tea, then that's your opinion. I just was offering my own. I have no problem with you. As for these other anonymous types though...
Anon,
I was giving my opinion on a topic that involves something I do, so take your bewilderment and shove it up your ass.
If you had any guts you wouldn't say your crap behind some anonymous posting, and if you knew anything in relation to this you'd know that a mop-top is the furtherest thing I have for a hairstyle.
By the way, I'm sure you're tearing up the ladder of success in life aren't you?
such a sensitive boy jason.
it's funny when people get on we shot jr and bitch about anonymous posts. what's the point of even using a screen name? most of them are fake anyways.
just because you use a screen name, it doesn't make you anymore of a credible badass.
i was just making fun of some jackass shit you said. i don't give a fuck what your name is, i would still make fun of you.
that's what makes this place so fun...
so get over it, or don't. i really don't care..
i wasn't accusing anyone of hiding behind screen names. re read if you like.
my point was, that most screen names are fake and might as well be anonymous.
Sensitive? Your trash talking so I responded. When someone trash talks you, do just shrug your shoulders, look to the ground, and say 'Yea, you're right *sigh*'? Doubtful, but then again, you hide behind being anonymous so it's clear you're some sort of bitch.
My name isn't fake, The Smoke is not at a secret location, so I'm a person that for better or for worst can be easily found.
All in all the point is you came out of the gate talking shit and I doubt you'd be so bold if it wasn't on the internet.
By the way, pardon my grammar on my last post. Considering your disposition, I'm sure that would have been the next thing you attack.
hey, I'm anonymous and I ain't not bitch!
jason-
really, no i wouldn't get on here just to defend some shit talk.
that would just fuel the fire. you can ask wanz about that.
but, then again, what would wsjr be without the wanz's of the world?
jason-
really, no i wouldn't get on here just to defend some shit talk.
that would just fuel the fire. you can ask wanz about that.
but, then again, what would wsjr be without the wanz's of the world?
whoa there jason!
i'm asian american and i've been to smoke before. you might even know me.
after what you said a few posts up, i promise i'll never bother you with my presence at another one of your events.
best of luck to you and all your white friends.
a-hole.
ONE....TWO.....THREE........
...M O D F I G H T!!!!!
White friends?
you hatin' on whitey?
seriously though, asian or not... if you're at lush.... well, you're probably just that (a lush).... if not someone who i'd rather not be around on a regular basis
....drinking flourescent beverages that cost $14.
reggaton rules
I'm hoping that he was joking about that.
oh, i so know who wrote that "reggaton" anon comment.
busted!
Hey, I heard next weekend POP POPPINS is playing with THE SPIN and SOUL FOOD CAFE on Canton & Crowdus
and then after that they're playing with CREAM OF MUSHROOM at THE HOP!!!
I'm going to miss this thread when it's gone. So many memories. I'd like to thank everyone involved. Especially...sniff...tear...the bands. Thank you, bands.
wow, this started at "worst post ever!" and ended up one of the more popular posts ever.
such is life.......
Thank you wakka-wakka. I appreciate the compliments.
I'm not a difficult person to get along with. I'm not looking to be showered with accolades. I'm just providing a night to play some music for me and the people who show up to enjoy.
If you have a problem with that, then f- off to some pool hall with the Garland System of a Down Army.*
*I wasn't referring to you in this wakka-wakka
That's funny.... my guitar teacher in highschool was in Soul Food Caffe.... if only i had taken voice lessons from the bald guy w/ the goatee (no, not Howie Mandell)
...oh, and i wrote the Reggeton comment, and i wouldn't guess that many people on this list know me.... so i'm probably not "busted"
Well at least you admit I'm ahead.
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